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definition of the word User_talk:Connel_MacKenzie/archive-2006-05

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I'm now part of the replacing team: User:Vildricianus/replace.js. But that's not what I wanted to say; rather, you're using the XML dumps to make rnd-en-wikt work? Looking for the ==English== header? Any chance to make it main-namespace-only? There's an error ratio of ~0.5% due to ==English== headers appearing on user talk pages. Apart from that minor fact, it's flawless, if moderately slow. —Vildricianus 20:25, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

I have a work-around to wait 1 second and retry when the Caché license limit error occurs. I will tweak it for NS:0, but I won't re-run it until the next XML dump (as I don't want to inadvertently reset the "Cleanup Random" thing until then...and I generate both lists at the same time.)
Take a look at the last link on my toolserver page..."Some numbers..." (just below the cleanup link.) Not all of those languages are linked on my toolserver page yet. (Yes, sometimes, I'm just lazy, that way.) --Connel MacKenzie T C 23:56, 24 May 2006 (UTC)

rfc on "へ/compare に"

Hi Connel. Your "?" comment on your removal of "noinclude" from "へ/compare に" suggests you're wondering either why I excluded {{rfc}} from the including pages or why I used an included page at all.

If you're wondering the former, I thought the RFC really just applies to the shared content instead of the including entries, but feel free to correct me if I misinterpreted the scope of that RFC. If you're wondering about the latter, it's a pretty poor attempt to show my suggestion for how to share content between related entries, similar to my oft-noted "theatre"/"theater" example. Whatever your question, I agree with your rfc, as the content is questionable for inclusion in individual dictionary entries. Rod (A. Smith) 23:35, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

Actually, the answer to the mystery is much simpler: I messed up. I didn't realize (until discussing on the RFC page) that it was being used as if it were a template. Then the phone rang...and I forgot to go back and clean it up. Please move it to the template namespace. --Connel MacKenzie T C 23:40, 25 May 2006 (UTC)
I don't want to be contrary, but that seems like a strange request. Is there some reason not to include main namespace pages? Rod (A. Smith) 23:56, 25 May 2006 (UTC)
Umm, the same reasons color/colour use {{color-colour (noun)}}. The main reasons are 1) template namespace is less confusing, when being used as a template, 2) cleanup activities focus on the main namespace (NS:0) which is why I keep running across へ/compare に 3) items in NS:0 are searched from the [Go] button by default, but nothing else, 4) The same priniciple that applies to Appendix:, Index:, Transwiki:, WikiSaurus:, etc.; things that aren't main namespace type things (with the notable exception of Main Page) don't belong in the main namespace.
That said, I could be completely wrong about へ/compare に. Perhaps the discussion should return now to the RFC page? --Connel MacKenzie T C 00:20, 26 May 2006 (UTC)


Hi Connel! I've noticed that there are quite a few transliterations in Sanskrit here on Wiktionary, but I'm not sure how they should be handled. Is there a transliteration policy for Sanskrit, or should both Devanagari and transliterations be added as entries? --Dijan 00:29, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

Sorry, I have no idea. I'm assuming the cleanup entries I find were entered in good faith, but beyond basic syntax, I try not to touch them. --Connel MacKenzie T C 00:45, 26 May 2006 (UTC)
The Sanskrit Wikipedia is written in Devanagari. I'm assuming Devanagari should be used to write entries in Sanskrit. Thanks. --Dijan 01:26, 26 May 2006 (UTC)


Hi Connel. I can't figure out when we passed 145,000. It could well be your CheatBot. SemperBlotto 07:24, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

Yes, it certainly was, but for some reason, the first two hundred 'bot entries did not affect the article count. When I returned later and ran the rest of them, they did. But it was at 145,003 when I saw DG's entry had hit the milestone. {sigh} :-) There's always 150,000... --Connel MacKenzie T C 07:56, 26 May 2006 (UTC)
When I had written that, I thought I was joking. natures it is, in honor of TheCheatBot entering plurals (and the other bots eventually entering all other forms.) --Connel MacKenzie T C 17:17, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

Latest language templates

I doubt you will, but if you ever get bored, here are the latest of language templates to be subst:'ed, with numbers in main namespace:

Yup, that's all that's left! (At least I think I didn't forget any). —Vildricianus 20:34, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

OK, all done. --Connel MacKenzie T C 00:14, 29 May 2006 (UTC)
Crazy! Thanks! —Vildricianus 16:15, 29 May 2006 (UTC)

MediaWiki:Pagemovedtext bugs

God knows what happened but it started bugging all of a sudden. I managed to kick it out with your <includeonly></includeonly> trick. Cheers. —Vildricianus 21:28, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

Heh. I usually bracket the ":" inbetwixt the includeonlys. At least something, as I'm convinced there are circumatances where it will make a difference (if not in MediaWiki, then within my off-line template subst routines.) --Connel MacKenzie T C 22:56, 26 May 2006 (UTC)

Template talk:beer parlour timeline

Sorry dude, I didn't see you had reworked this thing already. I'm sure you like the new version as well. What do we do with the old one? Preserve in a nostalgy archive? :-) —Vildricianus 22:27, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

  :-)   Well done. Is there a place for me to add the Alphabetical list of topics back in there at some point? --Connel MacKenzie T C 22:31, 28 May 2006 (UTC)
Ah yes, the headers. Say, you did/do that automatically, don't you? You may want to redo it perhaps: I reworked Wiktionary:Beer parlour archive/January-March 06 - it was inordinately large. —Vildricianus 23:16, 28 May 2006 (UTC)
Yes, I did it semi-automatically. Where should I put it now, when I run it again? --Connel MacKenzie T C 23:43, 28 May 2006 (UTC)
I've put it at the very bottom. —Vildricianus 22:12, 30 May 2006 (UTC)

TheCheatBot, subst'ing?

Looks like you subst:'ed {{plural of}} in its latest additions? It produces things like this:

# <span class='use-with-mention'>Plural of <span

Are you sure that's ok? Looks quite magical for the average user (did I miss a mention or announcement of this? Sorry then.) —Vildricianus 13:29, 29 May 2006 (UTC)

I'm sure that was an accident. Can Cheatbot go back and "de-subst"? Rod (A. Smith) 14:07, 29 May 2006 (UTC)
Ugh. When Ncik threatened to start vandalizing {{plural of}}, I experimented with subst:ing the template, on the generation pass. Later, when I ran the "201-to-end" entries, I forgot to undo that, before running. What I was focusing on checking was the list of entries, trying to catch "incorrect" plural entries, not looking at the entry contents.
The easiest way to "undo" it would be to delete those thousand+ entries, and re-run it. OTOH, cryptic or not, that part of the entry is not likely to be legitimately changed; it may be best to just leave them as they are?
--Connel MacKenzie T C 17:27, 29 May 2006 (UTC)
Mmm, perhaps not necessary to delete them. Subst'ing the template is also not necessary anymore - the template should anyway remain protected to prevent heavy server load. —Vildricianus 22:08, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
If you had a file with a wikified list of pages that TheCheatBot has editet, we could feed it to replace.py. If you have no such list, maybe repalce.py accepts "-links:http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Special:Contributions&limit=2000&target=TheCheatBot" as a parameter. In either case, the following would "unsubst" {{plural of}}:
replace.py -regex "# <span class='use-with-mention'>Plural of <span class='mention'>\[\[(?P<word>.*)\|\{\{\{2\|\g<word>}}}]]</span>\.</span>" "# {{plural of|\g<word>}}"
If you have no list and "-link:http..." is invalid, ignore this suggestion. Rod (A. Smith) 23:20, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
I have a partial list, as it got overwritten when I had to restart it for some unicode exceptions in the middle. But shuffling together a list from a raw Special:Contributions is an easy fallback, if the pywikipediabot code can't get the list itself.
I'm trying to understand <word> in your syntax above, and failing miserably. Is that, one word or any multiple? Or do you mean I should substitute it in, time and again, for each word? --Connel MacKenzie T C 06:48, 2 June 2006 (UTC)

You shouldn't need to modify "word" at all. In short, "it should just work." :-) "word" is the name of a named capture group.

(Brief diversion: You're probably familiar with numberd capture groups and backreferences, e.g. "(foo*)", "\0", and "\1". When you begin to use named capture groups, you'll find that you can make your pattern self-documenting to some extent. Once you know about named groups, it becomes much easier to read regex expressions that use well-named capture groups than it is to read the same expressions using numbered capture groups.

Anyway, "(?P<word>.*)" creates a named capture group with the name "word" and the regex pattern ".*". Due to the "word" capture group's position, it matches a string preceded by "span class='mention'>[[" and follwed by "|{{{2|".

Specifically, the "word" capture group matches and captures "knorr" in the example above. Then, the backreference "\g<word>" in the match pattern refers to the string captured, i.e. "knorr". It also refers to "knorr" in the replacement pattern. In short, "it should just work." :-) Rod (A. Smith) 08:11, 2 June 2006 (UTC)

Hmm. There are so many ways to specify named groups, I must have chosen the wrong syntax. I thought the Python syntax was "(?P<groupName>...)", but I guess not, oh well. BTW, I'm working on a Wiktionary-specific programatic editing framework and hope to expose it through I.E. plugins and web services. I guess I should say something about it on WT:GP, but not 'till there's actually something to show. Anyway, thanks for fixing the regex and running the cleanup. Rod (A. Smith) 05:57, 6 June 2006 (UTC)


You seem to have rfv-sensed the Shavout sense (I found it in category:RFV), but it isn't on the RFV page.

Anyway, having discovered that Shavout was a misspelling of Shavuot I found loads of books.google cites, ancient and modern, Jewish and Gentile, starting with the obvious (in hindsight) point that Pentecost is mentioned in the Bible before the Christian pentecostal miracle has occurred, so it appears to refer there to a Jewish festival. So I added some quotes, and did a whole lot more to other senses, including reordering historically. (Actually, it wasn't that simple -- I started out last night on a completely different track -- see History if you want a laugh.)

And then, only then (slap), I read the Talk page and found that we've been here before (though without any positive results that time -- not even noticing the spelling). Anyway, if you're happy with my cites, perhaps you would remove the tag, rather than listing the rfv.

I've also picked up that there are minor errors in Passover & Easter, each implying that they normally fall on the same day (which seems unlikely given that, in many years, the Eastern Orthodox churches can't even agree with the Western churches re the date for Easter). I'll check and amend soon, but no time now. --Enginear 06:43, 30 May 2006 (UTC)

I'll suppress my laughter, and remove the rfv now! :-) --Connel MacKenzie T C 06:45, 30 May 2006 (UTC)


Yo CMK, on lenition there was Category: Experimental interwiki translation links, which I removed, during my sporadic Special:Categories sweep. Did you know that we have a template Template:t that works similar to what you had there (I occasionally use it when I remember, and I beleive Paul G does too). --Newnoise (Shout louder) 11:29, 30 May 2006 (UTC)

I was aware of several such experiments, but I know they received criticism, and none gained popular support. --Connel MacKenzie T C 14:21, 30 May 2006 (UTC)

More CSS

WT:CUSTOM#Change headers, last note. You wanted Courier new for spotting spurious usernames, didn't you? —Vildricianus 16:37, 30 May 2006 (UTC)

Sweetness! Thank you. Actually, it may be more important to identify usernames than titles, but this works if I visit their userpage. (Can RecentChanges even be messed with?) --Connel MacKenzie T C 16:41, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
The content of most Special pages is withing the class special, so you could set
.special { font-family:courier new }
but that will also change Wanted pages & co, and I don't know how useful it is anyway (doesn't work with "enhanced recent changes" btw). JavaScript could probably do more if you want all usernames displayed in Courier. You can always look at the source code of pages and see which parts are defined by a class. In CSS, classes or IDs are easy to mess with. Most other things are beyond me. —Vildricianus 17:28, 30 May 2006 (UTC)


Hi - I have set up CommonsTicker and posted test entries on Wiktionary:CommonsTicker. Teh bot is not active yet, but I just have to throw the switch. The ticker page is not "styled" yet, if you want, copy the required bits from meta:User:Duesentrieb/CommonsTicker#CSS to the global css if Wiktionary. There are a few options for CommonsTicker:

Talk to me at de:Benutzer Diskussion:Duesentrieb or better, catch me in IRC - i'll be there for another couple of hours; i'm there pretty much every day -- CommonsTicker 22:31, 30 May 2006 (UTC)


Hi - just wondering why you deleted my entry on spodding?

Unsigned comment from User:
I used the [rollback] feature hoping to unconver some valid content from previous entries. Since there is none, I tagged the remaining entry with {{rfv}}. --Connel MacKenzie T C 21:43, 31 May 2006 (UTC)


Would you mind me rewording the entire message? It's big, flashy and too pink to be the welcoming message I'd want to receive. Looks like we could do with some brevity here. —Vildricianus 21:45, 31 May 2006 (UTC)

No. I tried a couple times to solict help rewording it, but each time it got longer! --Connel MacKenzie T C 22:13, 31 May 2006 (UTC)
Please take a read now. Made it quite simple and similar to the standard welcome template. —Vildricianus 15:23, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
How about pointing your python machine to subst all remnants of welcoming sprees? There are about 200. Could you do that or does that actually take up time? (I've tried, but I guess I'll never be able to set up a bot myself). — Vildricianus 22:07, 3 June 2006 (UTC)
I wanted to do them manually to make sure they got the proper date stuffed in, instead of the default date. But since that mechanism has changed, that may no longer be possible. OK, I'll fire them off now. --Connel MacKenzie T C 22:12, 3 June 2006 (UTC)
Fortunately we don't have barnstars over here, or someone would have to give it to you. — Vildricianus 22:22, 3 June 2006 (UTC)
Probably Template:welcome needs the same treatment (390 transclusions). — Vildricianus 12:12, 4 June 2006 (UTC)
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